Re: General Discussion
13967Count me in on one not very pleased with the Gimenez / Naylor salary dumps.
Why is this team forever on the cheap? since 2000, we had 3 season where the payroll topped 100 mil, 2017, 2018 & 2019. This year should be one of them). Especially now when we're knocking on the door.
We had a legitimate shot at going to the series in 2025. Those odds just slipped a few notches.
Detroit came close and so did Kansas City in 2024. Minnesota was in it right up until the end. It's going to be that much tougher to win the division much less heading to the World Series in 2025. This was not the right time to dump Gimenez or Naylor or their production.
Better hope that Ramirez does not have any prolonged slumps (which is not out of the realm of possibility).
There is no way in hell that we have anyone in the organization that is going to make up for the loss in production between Naylor and Gimenez. We needed additions and not subtractions.
I was po'd when we traded Lindor when we could have had the best keystone combination in baseball along side Ramirez. I'm sick to think we had that same chance in 2025 with Gimenez and Rocchio. Not often you get this kind of opportunity just when the two were fitting together like a hand in glove.
I'm reading where Gimenez's production has slipped the past two seasons. This year, Gimenez had 21 runs saved on defense. He averaged 21 the last 3 season.
In 2024, Gimenez had 63 ribis, 22 doubles, a triple, 9 homer and 30 stolen bases. I can only dream where Gimenez's replacement can put up those kinds of numbers.
In ridding ourselves of Gimenez and Naylor, we lose not only major league experience but also playoff experience on the grandest stage. Their replacements most likely will have little major league experience much less playoff experience. Sorry folks, but, in my opinion, we shot ourselves in the foot.
Will Naylor's replacement put up Naylor-like numbers, like 31 homers and 108 rbis???? Personally, I don't think so.
You can't lose that much production and expect to win. It took a lot of gears to mesh last year. Can one expect the same one more year?
What did we really gain during the wnter meetngs? A number 2/3 starting pitcher???
Could give a crap about the minor leaguers we picked up. Yeah, they may develop into decent players 3 years down the road. I was looking more at tomorrow. Our window of opportunity is 2025. It should have been 2024. I'm getting pretty tired of looking at what will happen in the future when the opportunity is now.
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Why is this team forever on the cheap? since 2000, we had 3 season where the payroll topped 100 mil, 2017, 2018 & 2019. This year should be one of them). Especially now when we're knocking on the door.
We had a legitimate shot at going to the series in 2025. Those odds just slipped a few notches.
Detroit came close and so did Kansas City in 2024. Minnesota was in it right up until the end. It's going to be that much tougher to win the division much less heading to the World Series in 2025. This was not the right time to dump Gimenez or Naylor or their production.
Better hope that Ramirez does not have any prolonged slumps (which is not out of the realm of possibility).
There is no way in hell that we have anyone in the organization that is going to make up for the loss in production between Naylor and Gimenez. We needed additions and not subtractions.
I was po'd when we traded Lindor when we could have had the best keystone combination in baseball along side Ramirez. I'm sick to think we had that same chance in 2025 with Gimenez and Rocchio. Not often you get this kind of opportunity just when the two were fitting together like a hand in glove.
I'm reading where Gimenez's production has slipped the past two seasons. This year, Gimenez had 21 runs saved on defense. He averaged 21 the last 3 season.
In 2024, Gimenez had 63 ribis, 22 doubles, a triple, 9 homer and 30 stolen bases. I can only dream where Gimenez's replacement can put up those kinds of numbers.
In ridding ourselves of Gimenez and Naylor, we lose not only major league experience but also playoff experience on the grandest stage. Their replacements most likely will have little major league experience much less playoff experience. Sorry folks, but, in my opinion, we shot ourselves in the foot.
Will Naylor's replacement put up Naylor-like numbers, like 31 homers and 108 rbis???? Personally, I don't think so.
You can't lose that much production and expect to win. It took a lot of gears to mesh last year. Can one expect the same one more year?
What did we really gain during the wnter meetngs? A number 2/3 starting pitcher???
Could give a crap about the minor leaguers we picked up. Yeah, they may develop into decent players 3 years down the road. I was looking more at tomorrow. Our window of opportunity is 2025. It should have been 2024. I'm getting pretty tired of looking at what will happen in the future when the opportunity is now.
<
“Every day is a new opportunity. You can build on yesterday's success or put its failures behind and start over again. That's the way life is, with a new game every day, and that's the way baseball is.”
-- Bob Feller
-- Bob Feller
Re: General Discussion
13968Did I miss a Naylor trade ? Did not think so. The imaginary Naylor trade post is almost as bad as your take on the Giminez trade. Giminez for a #2 or #3 starter with 4 years of contract control is a great trade.
We have players that can play 2nd. We do not have enough controllable contract starting pitchers. Saving 10 million is just a bonus.
GEEZ !
We have players that can play 2nd. We do not have enough controllable contract starting pitchers. Saving 10 million is just a bonus.
GEEZ !
Re: General Discussion
13969I love Giminez's defense; could be one of the best ever at his relays.
But we have 2nd basemen of quality just behind him so a trade was inevitable sooner or later
Ortiz has the look of a solid addition to the rotation well ahead of his arbitration years.
If we were deep in major league pitching the trade might have been delayed a year.
But we have 2nd basemen of quality just behind him so a trade was inevitable sooner or later
Ortiz has the look of a solid addition to the rotation well ahead of his arbitration years.
If we were deep in major league pitching the trade might have been delayed a year.
Re: General Discussion
13971I guess I blew the Naylor call.
Tried to find the article I was reading concerning Horwitz. Can't find it.
Still doesn't soften the blow of losing Gimenez. I still don't think we have anyone to replace Gimenez in the near future, like next year. Gimenez's experience was invaluable. It's also the intangibles that will be even harder to replace. This has to be a shock to Rocchio. ;The two formed a close bond.
Time to make a run at Roki Susaki. What's to lose?
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Tried to find the article I was reading concerning Horwitz. Can't find it.
Still doesn't soften the blow of losing Gimenez. I still don't think we have anyone to replace Gimenez in the near future, like next year. Gimenez's experience was invaluable. It's also the intangibles that will be even harder to replace. This has to be a shock to Rocchio. ;The two formed a close bond.
Time to make a run at Roki Susaki. What's to lose?
<
“Every day is a new opportunity. You can build on yesterday's success or put its failures behind and start over again. That's the way life is, with a new game every day, and that's the way baseball is.”
-- Bob Feller
-- Bob Feller
Re: General Discussion
13972From AZ papers on Cecconi:
In parts of two seasons in the majors, Cecconi owns a 6.06 ERA in 104 innings. He has the stuff to be an effective pitcher. He throws hard and can elicit swings and misses with his secondary stuff, namely his slider, but has struggled to maintain consistency from outing to outing.
“He’s going to figure out how to pitch at this level,” Hazen said. “He has really good weapons. I’ve said this a million times: If you want to get good players, you have to give up good players.”
In parts of two seasons in the majors, Cecconi owns a 6.06 ERA in 104 innings. He has the stuff to be an effective pitcher. He throws hard and can elicit swings and misses with his secondary stuff, namely his slider, but has struggled to maintain consistency from outing to outing.
“He’s going to figure out how to pitch at this level,” Hazen said. “He has really good weapons. I’ve said this a million times: If you want to get good players, you have to give up good players.”
"I've suffered a great many tragedies in my life....most of them never happened". Mark Twain
Re: General Discussion
13973I agree, but, how many times have I heard that one before. We should have gotten more in return.“He’s going to figure out how to pitch at this level,” Hazen said. “He has really good weapons. I’ve said this a million times:
Exactly! Applies perfectly in the Luzardo trade.If you want to get good players, you have to give up good players.”
<
“Every day is a new opportunity. You can build on yesterday's success or put its failures behind and start over again. That's the way life is, with a new game every day, and that's the way baseball is.”
-- Bob Feller
-- Bob Feller
Re: General Discussion
13974Except the Phillies did not trade any for sure good players for Luzardo.
Re: General Discussion
13975My point. We could have offered a better package.
Luzardo would have been a perfect fit.
He's a lefty.
All our candidates are righties except for Allen.
AFter all, what did we expect from Boyd and Cobb coming of surgeries?
Tanner Bibee RH
Ben Lively RH
Gavin Williams RH
Luis Ortiz RH
Triston McKenzie RH
Logan Allen LH
Slade Cecconi RH
Shane Bieber RH
<
Luzardo would have been a perfect fit.
He's a lefty.
All our candidates are righties except for Allen.
AFter all, what did we expect from Boyd and Cobb coming of surgeries?
Tanner Bibee RH
Ben Lively RH
Gavin Williams RH
Luis Ortiz RH
Triston McKenzie RH
Logan Allen LH
Slade Cecconi RH
Shane Bieber RH
<
“Every day is a new opportunity. You can build on yesterday's success or put its failures behind and start over again. That's the way life is, with a new game every day, and that's the way baseball is.”
-- Bob Feller
-- Bob Feller
Re: General Discussion
13976We've done fine without a lefty in most recent seasons. I don't care what arm they use if they're good they're good; if they're not they're not.
What is with Logan Allens anyway? One good season and done? They ought to be able to get Logan II back to big league form at least for the bullpen
What is with Logan Allens anyway? One good season and done? They ought to be able to get Logan II back to big league form at least for the bullpen
Re: General Discussion
13977I have thought since the trade of Civale in 2023 that Naylor has been disgruntled. Acquiring Manzardo meant that Naylor would never get a long term extension and i still think he was the reason that Francona made the FO travel to Texas to address the team.
I am surprised that Santana was signed but not surprised that the FO hedged their bet.
I am surprised that Santana was signed but not surprised that the FO hedged their bet.
Re: General Discussion
13978Andre Knott says that this past July that Carlos Santana (while with the Twins) told Tom Hamilton and him that he wanted to return to Cleveland. Chris Antonetti was within earshot and went over to talk to Carlos.
Re: General Discussion
13979I was surprised to see Carlos with something of a bounce back year with the Twins. Great guy: he volunteered to play LF, to play 3B, to do anything the team wanted. Impressed that at age 38 he won his first Gold Glove. I don't expect as productive an offensive season from him as we got last year from Josh or I would expect in the future from Josh.
If it's viewed as a trade of Naylor for Santana with an unlikely to succeed pitcher thrown in I guess it's not a bad exchange. The draft pick is somewhere near impossible to value.
If it's viewed as a trade of Naylor for Santana with an unlikely to succeed pitcher thrown in I guess it's not a bad exchange. The draft pick is somewhere near impossible to value.