Terry Pluto wants Ben McLemore:

About the Cavaliers...

Kansas freshman Ben McLemore clearly has the greatest offensive skills of those players expected to go at the top of the June 27 NBA Draft. So why not choose him?AP file

Should the Cavs take Nerlens Noel at No. 1? I'm not sure. Not at all.

Most fans know about Noel's ACL injury, which ended his freshman season at Kentucky in February. They know he weighed only 206 pounds at the NBA combine, a major concern for a 6-11 shot-blocking center. The weight doesn't bother me. He won't be 20 until next April, and he will add weight and he may even still be growing.

Defensively, he can become a monster. He not only blocked 4.4 shots per game, he also averaged 2.1 steals. He can run and jump. His offense is raw, but it will improve because he is so young and has a solid work ethic.

But the knee is a concern -- especially since it's the second injury. Noel missed most of his sophomore season in high school with an injury to the growth plate in his left knee. That makes me nervous.

Because of that, I'm wondering, "Should the Cavs should make Ben McLemore the top pick?" The 6-5 guard from Kansas may be the best scorer in the draft.

Consider this:

1. They really liked Bradley Beal in 2012, but he went No. 3 to Washington. They took Dion Waiters at No. 4.

2. Many teams -- including the Cavs -- believe McLemore is a superior shooter and scorer than Beal, who shot .445 from the field at Florida. McLemore was .495 at Kansas. On 3-pointers, it was .339 for Beal, .420 for McLemore.

3. Beal averaged 13.9 points and shot .410 (.386 on 3-pointers) as a rookie for Washington. Waiters averaged 14.7 points and shot .412 (.310 on 3-pointers).

4. Yes, the Cavs need a small forward, and Otto Porter is the best one in the draft. But not many teams project Porter to become an impact player. He does a lot of things reasonably well, and especially is effective moving without the ball. But do you take Porter over Noel's defensive presence or McLemore's scoring? I doubt the Cavs will do that.

5. McLemore is 6-4 and averaged 5.2 rebounds per game in the backcourt. That's a sign of athleticism. He is a pure shooting guard. I wish he'd drive more (3.7 attempts per game), especially because he was .870 at the foul line.

6. McLemore attended three high schools. He was a redshirt at Kansas, putting his academics in order. His college coaches wished he'd be more aggressive looking for his shot.

7. With Waiters and Kyrie Irving in the backcourt, why take McLemore? If he is the most talented player, you take him. Waiters becomes the sixth man, a role he played at Syracuse and briefly last season. Waiters can play either guard spot. Irving does get hurt, so the Cavs have real depth at guard.

8. They can sign (or more likely trade for) a veteran small forward who can score. They have the cap room. Suppose a team wants a young player in a deal? They would have Waiters available to trade.

7. With Waiters and Kyrie Irving in the backcourt, why take McLemore? If he is the most talented player, you take him.

Exactly why you would not take him. He is not the most talented at all. He might not be in the top 5. Noel, Porter, Oladipo, Len, and then you can argue Bennet, McLemore, and Burke.

Just draft Noel and be done with it. Add a stopgap free agent SF, move up in the draft from # 19 and take the BPA with whatever picks we end up with. Rumor has it that San Antonio would love to get out of the # 13 spot. It's highly doubtful that any team is going to trade us a franchise defensive force for the rights to the first pick, or any other kind of franchise player for that matter. Noel will be an elite defender in the league and defense is a key to winning championships. Just having an elite shot blocker and ball hawk like Noel protecting the rim will enhance the offensive skills and hide the defensive deficiencies of other players on the roster. Maybe not this year but by next year for sure.

The team will be a playoff team if they can keep AV on the floor through the end of the season, regardless of what happens in the draft. Just having Mike Brown teach this group how to play effective team defense will get them in. Another year of experience for Kyrie, Dion, Tristan and Zeller will also make a world of difference.

We can afford to give Noel some time to rehab and work on his NBA readiness (gaining more muscle and weight). Reportedly he is already well on his way, and working his butt off.

I was leaning towards picking Len or Porter, but that was before we won the draft lottery and I was assuming we'd pick 3rd or later.

So I decide to watch some playoffs last night, hoping for a miracle.

I knew LeBoy had gotten his 'Pippen' sideman in D-Wade - but when did he get his Rodman? The Birdman? What was that? And he was going to set a record for highest field goal %?

Too weird.

Watching 5 minutes was too long...

One of the most complete articles I've seen regarding the latest NBA possibilities:

NBA Draft source: Celtics have their Josh Smith sign-and-trade offer ready


Sean Deveney Sporting News Follow on Twitter Archive Email RSS

Consider the departure of Doc Rivers Phase II of the Celtics’ slow dismantling, which began last summer with Ray Allen leaving Boston. Phase III will come this week, when Boston must either trade Paul Pierce or decide to buy him out. They have until June 30 to inform Pierce of such a move.

As for the rebuilding sure to follow the dismantling, that is contingent on what happens with Pierce. If the Celtics can unload Pierce to a team with enough cap space to absorb his salary, they will get a trade exception worth Pierce’s salary, or $15.3 million. And if that happens, the plan is already in place. According to a source, the Celtics have a sign-and-trade offer ready for Atlanta forward Josh Smith that would be the top priority in free agency.

The Boston Celtics have a sign-and-trade offer prepared for Josh Smith in the event they can move Paul Pierce and make a run at the Hawks forward. (AP Photo)

Smith has long been connected to Boston in trade rumors, including one that would have sent Pierce to Atlanta in February. His link to the current Celtics dates back to high school, when he played with point guard Rajon Rondo at Oak Hill.

In order to land Smith, though, the Celtics need to pull off a deal for Pierce that will net them a trade exception. Because teams over the salary cap can’t take on salary without sending back matching salaries, Boston’s options are limited to teams under the cap. That’s why two teams that have been connected to a Pierce deal have been Cleveland and Milwaukee.

But sources told Sporting News that there is some trepidation when it comes to trading for Pierce, because he has let it be known that if he must leave Boston, he wants to play for a contender. He could do that—most likely joining Rivers in Los Angeles—if the Celtics buy him out. But not if he is traded. The Cavaliers, for example, don’t want to trade for Pierce if he does not want to be there.

A source indicated that any potential Pierce-to-Cleveland deal is, “a longshot.”

There is some skepticism about Milwaukee’s interest in Pierce, too. The Bucks were close to landing Smith via trade in February, and Smith is willing to go to Milwaukee in free agency. While the Celtics would be able to offer Smith a deal starting at $15 million—the value of the trade exception they’d get for trading Pierce—the Bucks could offer a full max deal, starting at $17.5 million.

If the Bucks are in a better position to land Smith in free agency, they would not have much incentive to instead take on the 35-year-old Pierce, and help Boston get Smith instead.

CLIPPERS SOON TO DEAL BLEDSOE

On the flip side, now that the Clippers’ situation has settled, LA is expected to move on to the other big issue looming over its summer: Eric Bledsoe.

We’ve been talking about Bledsoe as a trade chip since February—the Clippers can’t afford to pay him what he will command when he hits restricted free agency—and it appears that a deal involving Bledsoe will come soon.

Most likely, that deal will send Bledsoe and Caron Butler to Orlando for guard Arron Afflalo, addressing the Clippers’ need for a shooting guard. It’s a big price for the Clippers to pay, but knowing they won’t keep Bledsoe long-term, LA needs to get value while it can.

Also on the Clippers’ front, now that a deal involving Kevin Garnett is off the table, they must decide what to do with DeAndre Jordan. It might be difficult to bring back a guy the franchise was so obviously ambivalent about keeping this summer. Multiple teams have expressed interest in Jordan, including Portland, which has cap space and is now run by Neil Olshey, the Clippers’ former general manager who drafted Jordan.

JIMMER ON THE MOVE

Jimmer, we hardly knew ye.

According to ESPN.com, just two years into his tenure, the Kings are looking to move guard Jimmer Fredette in an effort to get a low first-round pick, where the team would take a shooting guard. The site pointed to Indiana (No. 23) or Utah (No. 21) as potential destinations for Fredette.

The move would make sense for both teams. Fredette was extremely popular at BYU, and when he came out for the draft two years ago, the Jazz would likely have taken him had Sacramento’s then-owners, the Maloof brothers, not sought to cash in on Fredette’s popularity.

As for the Pacers, their bench was horribly lacking in scoring and shooting—in the postseason, the team shot 32.7 percent from the 3-point line. Indiana would like a veteran who can shoot, and Fredette made 41.7 percent of his shots from the 3-point line. What would remain to be seen is whether coach Frank Vogel could stomach Fredette’s defensive shortcomings.

SMALL ISSUE OF DENG RUMORS

Looking over this year’s draft, the Bulls are surely feeling a pang of regret. For the second straight year, they’re considering a trade involving small forward Luol Deng, though it is unlikely anything comes to fruition by draft night.

Last year, the Bulls had the opportunity to send Deng to the Warriors in a deal that would have sent Harrison Barnes to Chicago and would have yanked the Bulls out of the range of the luxury tax. Ultimately, Chicago passed on that trade and Barnes went on to have a solid rookie year, averaging 9.2 points and 4.1 rebounds and flashing impressive athleticism.

Now, if the Bulls do resurrect talks involving Deng—and, again, the Cavs are the most likely target—it would be unlikely that they’d come up with a better haul than Barnes.

On Cavs (Personally, I like Len):

Despite numerous reports to the contrary, multiple sources say the Cleveland Cavaliers have yet to make a decision concerning who they’ll take with the No. 1 pick.

The Cavs continue to mull their options at No. 1.

They are engaged in trade talks with a number of teams. Sources say the Thunder, Timberwolves and Blazers have been the most proactive in trying to get the No. 1 pick -- but so far neither team has persuaded the Cavs to move out of the top pick.

The Cavs have narrowed down their list of prospects, according to sources, and it looks like it may ultimately come down to a battle between Kentucky's Noel and Maryland’s Alex Len. I’m still persuaded, though not convinced, that it will be Noel.

Here’s my thinking:
Noel told Louisville's Courier-Journal on Sunday that the Cavs' lead doctor, Dr. Richard Parker, had medically cleared him. I’ve had that confirmed by several sources. The Cavs have no serious issues with his knee.

The Cavs are stressing that they’re taking the best talent available, regardless of team needs or development curve.

The Cavs believe that given the strength of their roster, it’s unlikely that they’ll draft a starter. They believe their core of Kyrie Irving, Dion Waiters, Tristan Thompson and Anderson Varejao is better than anyone they could draft at No. 1. They also believe that while they have a huge hole at small forward, they’ll use their cap space to find a veteran small forward to fill that hole. Regardless of who they draft, he is likely coming off the bench.

That means the Cavs are less likely to focus on which prospect will have the greatest impact now. They are free to take the player they think will be better down the road. If history is any guide, the Cavs have a proven track record of taking young, less experienced prospects that show big upside.

They also have selected players that have, historically, graded out strongly in the various analytic measures they employ. Irving, Thompson and Waiters all ranked very highly by virtually every analytical tool.

All of that suggests to me that Noel, not Len, is likely to be the No. 1 pick. Noel has the most upside of any player in the draft. He tests at the top or near the top of every analytical tool I’ve seen (here’s Kevin Pelton’s WARP where Noel comes out on top). In fact, if I had to put a second player down, I think it would be UNLV’s Anthony Bennett who fits the criteria best.

While I know Len is in the picture and is a tempting option, he has a couple of things going against him. One, he has his own medical concerns and may be on a return timetable similar to Noel’s. Two, he rates poorly on most of the analytical tools I’ve read (he came in as the 26th prospect on Kevin Pelton’s WARP). While he might be the “safer” pick, I would be surprised if the Cavs made it just out of fear.
One last point on Noel. Given his steep improvement from November to February, if Noel had not hurt his knee -- Kentucky is in the tournament, Noel is the leader of the team, his numbers keep improving and he's the consensus No. 1 pick across the board. So, if he Cavs aren't worried about the knee ... isn't he the same guy they had ranked No. 1 on their board all season?

The Cavs are pushing to acquire the No. 13 overall pick from the Mavericks in order to select Sergey Karasev, league sources tell Yahoo! Sports' Adrian Wojnarowski.
According to Wojnarowski, the Cavs believe they have to get ahead of the Bucks at No. 15 and may need to jump higher to ensure Karasev is available. The Russian-born swingman recently returned to Russia, which fueled speculation he had a first-round promise from at least one team. If Wojnarowski's report is true, he may have a promise from multiple teams. As always with pre-draft rumors, make sure to read everything with a large grain of salt.

Really tired of Grant picking undersized players for their posiotion. To be sure TT, DW and now AB are good players but Grant has hamstrung this team by going small on each occasion.

A package of Jonas, Harrison Barnes and #1 would have been much more tempting to Minnesota, and a package for Aldridge too would have been more likely imo. Now we are smaller than the average player at every position on the floor.

I had hoped for someone who actually stacks up size wise. I would ahve thought Livingston impact, and Indiana's team would have driven that point home.

Not real happy with letting Crabbe go either. He is taller and more athletic than Sergey. He need some size and shooting and crabbe can light it up.

In the smallest of silver linigs, I guess we are now more appealing to Oden (if healthy) than other teams because we clearly need his size and minutes wouldn't be an issue

Just my 2 cents on FA, but my targets would be the following in this order

Pekovic 4yrs @ 52 mill
Tony Allen 3 yrs @ 14 mill
Mike Dunleavy 2 yrs @ 6.5 mill
Dorell Wright 3 yrs @ 11.5 mill

Earl Clark - F/C - Cavaliers

Earl Clark has agreed to a two-year, $9 million deal with the Cavaliers.
The Cavs were one of the first to show their interest in Clark during this free agency period. Clark gets a nice raise from his $1.2 million from last season and he earned it as one of the pleasant surprises in the league last year. He has a little bit of everything to his game and the Cavs could choose to use him at small forward. He'll be worth watching as a sleeper pick, depending on how Cleveland will use top pick Anthony Bennett.

I liked this article/interview with Dwight:

How Dwight Howard Settled On Houston
By Alex Kennedy
Senior NBA Writer

Dwight Howard’s decision was not an easy one. Free agents don’t walk away from the Los Angeles Lakers. Professional athletes do not leave tens of millions of dollars on the table. The Houston Rockets ultimately won this sweepstakes, but Howard struggled with the choice through Friday evening.

After meeting with all his potential suitors, Howard escaped to Aspen for several days. While making arguably the toughest decision of his life, he was occasionally stopped by fans who would ask him where he was headed. Howard would sign autographs and take pictures, but could only respond, “I don’t know.” This wasn’t Howard trying to conceal the information or wait until the time was right to make his announcement. This was a 27-year-old legitimately grappling with a difficult process and the unfortunate reality that he was going to let millions of people down regardless of what he decided.

One by one, Howard removed teams from consideration. Rather than keeping those teams in the dark, Howard contacted each of them and let them know they had been ruled out. He wanted to avoid the type of backlash that LeBron James had received for failing to contact teams prior to The Decision.

He placed a call to Dallas, so Mark Cuban emailed members of the media to share the disappointing news. He placed a call to Atlanta, so Danny Ferry quickly turned to other free agents and finalized deals with Paul Millsap and DeMarre Carroll. He placed a call to Golden State, so Bob Myers informed his staff, but still celebrated the team’s surprising acquisition of Andre Iguodala. Three teams down, two to go.

That left two teams – Houston and Los Angeles – and one decision that Howard was dreading. Most people in Howard’s camp knew that it would come down to these two teams, but they were unsure which he would pick. The Rockets had long been the frontrunner to acquire Howard since James Harden and Chandler Parsons had started recruiting him in early May. However, the Lakers were still very much in consideration – a storied franchise that could offer a fifth contract year and $30 million more.

Howard understood that the financial gap wasn’t quite that significant due to differences in taxes and cost of living, along with the fact that he’ll likely sign another lucrative contract, but it was still difficult for him to walk away from so much money. An athlete never knows when they’ll sign their last contract, and Howard had felt extremely vulnerable for the first time in his career last season – more human than Superman – as he battled back and shoulder injuries that drastically limited him on the court.

Howard thought long and hard about these two teams. He considered the pros and cons and discussed the options with advisers, friends, family members and a number of players around the league. The reason Howard waited nearly five hours after the first report to make his announcement is because he hadn’t yet decided. He was leaning toward Houston, sure, but he wasn’t ready to finalize his decision and announce it.

Howard, along with his agents and managers, hopped on a private plane to L.A. so that he could inform the Lakers of his decision, but even during that flight he was considering both situations. While most of the basketball world had moved on and already put Howard on Houston’s roster, the man whose word mattered most wasn’t ready to commit just yet. It wasn’t until 9:30 p.m. ET that Howard made his final decision and informed the Lakers and Rockets. Up until that point, he hadn’t told Los Angeles or Houston one way or the other, which is why neither side had expressed disappointment or excitement at the reports. They were waiting to hear from Howard, and the big man hadn’t made up his mind.

When Howard called Rockets general manager Daryl Morey to give him the news, Morey couldn’t hide his excitement and let out a scream. At this time last year, Houston’s best player was Kevin Martin and Morey was on the hot seat. The team seemed poised for a long rebuilding process since the Rockets had collected assets to make a splashy move, but couldn’t pull the trigger on a deal. They had swung and missed on free agents like Chris Bosh and Nene in recent years. They had tried to trade for Carmelo Anthony and even Howard. However, stars weren’t interested in Houston.

Then, Morey landed James Harden last October, signed him to a max contract and the rest is history. The Rockets won 45 games and gave the Oklahoma City Thunder a very tough series in the first round of the playoffs. Now, with Howard, Houston has positioned themselves to be an elite contender in the Western Conference for years to come.

“I felt like Houston was the best fit for me,” Howard told HOOPSWORLD in an exclusive interview. “I felt that James and I would really have an opportunity to grow together. I felt like having a coach like Kevin McHale and having Hakeem Olajuwon, who’s in Houston, can really help me grow as a player – help me as a post player and help my overall game. It was very appealing. I felt like this was a great opportunity for me to start fresh. I’m just looking forward to this opportunity.

“Ah man, I’m very excited. I’m very excited. I’m looking forward to it. I’ve been in contact with James and we’ve just been talking about developing a good relationship so we can lead that team as far as we can. We’ve been talking about winning championships. … Nothing is ever promised, but I feel like this is going to be a great opportunity for us to win. Playing with a guy like James and the rest of the team they have, we have a great opportunity. You only have a small window to win in the NBA. I think this gives me a good window, a good opportunity, to win. I’m going to do what I can to help this team win. I think, right now, I’m the oldest guy on the team so I’ll be the youngest veteran in the NBA. But it’s a great opportunity. Looking at this team and the team we had in Orlando, it’s a very similar team, but we’re adding a guy like James Harden to that team. It’s a great opportunity.”

After Howard made his decision, he was relieved that the process was over. While fans were sick of hearing reports related to Howard’s future, nobody was more fed up with it than Howard himself.

“I’m sick and tired of all the sources,” Howard said. “I’m sick of people coming up with stories. I mean, it’s just a blessing for me. I had the opportunity to go through all of this – go through this process – but it’s been tough. Seeing all of the stuff on the internet. Seeing stuff that the reporters are saying when it’s nowhere near true and not who I am as a person. I was perceived as someone who I’m not. It hurt a lot. It really hurt a lot. But the only thing now is to move forward. I have an opportunity to get past all of that and I’m looking forward to it. This summer has been great. I’ve gotten away from everything this summer. I didn’t pay attention to anything that was being put out there on T.V. I had to hear about it, but I didn’t focus on any of that stuff. I focused on getting better. I’m just looking forward to the next half of my career.

“Now, I’ll get a chance to just put down the hammer somewhere and just play. There’s no more uncertainty. People don’t have to worry about anything for the next four years or say anything for the next four years. I’m just going to play and be who I am. I’ll get back everything that I lost. I’m looking forward to it.”

While Howard didn’t hide his happiness about getting a fresh start in Houston, he did express disappointment for how his stint with the Lakers went and spoke of how hard it was to leave.

“Very tough,” Howard said. “Very, very, very tough. Very, very tough. People wouldn’t understand. Walking away from them and walking away from $30 million. That shows you right there that I want to win. I want to win. Nothing else matters other than winning. I don’t think anybody would’ve ever walked away from $30 million, but I want to win. But yeah, just walking away was tough. I was walking away from six million fans. I was walking away from a storied franchise. All of that makes it tough and it makes it a really, really big risk. I learned a lot from the situation in Orlando though, when I was afraid to walk away because I didn’t want to hurt people. I was afraid to leave because everything seemed like it was great. But now, I’m doing what’s best for Dwight. People are going to be mad and upset either way, so I’d rather be happy. I want to be happy playing basketball rather than upset doing what everyone wants me to do.”

Many fans placed the blame of Howard’s departure on Kobe Bryant’s shoulders after reports surfaced that he challenged Howard during the Lakers’ meeting. Rather than delivering an affectionate message like Mitch Kupchak, Steve Nash, Jeanie Buss and many others associated with the Lakers, Bryant reportedly told Howard that he had to “learn how it’s done first, and I can teach you here.” However, Howard defended Bryant and gave a different version of the events.

“He didn’t say anything of that sort,” Howard said of Bryant. “People twisted a lot of stuff that he said. But in my personal opinion, I’m a winner. I’m a winner because I’ve been playing for nine years when the average career for an NBA player is three years. I’m a winner because I made it to the NBA from a small school in Atlanta, GA, with 16 people in a class. I’m a winner because I’m succeeding in life. I’ve had problems and I’m not better than the next man, but I’m going to push myself to be a winner when it comes to winning a championship. But he didn’t say anything like that and a lot of people twisted what he did say.”

Fans in Los Angeles wondered if Howard would have stayed had Phil Jackson been hired as the team’s head coach early in the 2012-13 season rather than Mike D’Antoni. Howard confirmed that he never truly fit in D’Antoni’s system and hinted that Jackson in L.A. may have changed things.

“Well, I asked to have him as my coach earlier in the year,” Howard said, followed by a long pause before changing the topic. “The best decision for me was to do what’s best for Dwight. I think this is the best thing for me. This wasn’t a decision about anybody else. I didn’t have anybody pushing me to do anything. This is what Dwight wanted.”

Now, Howard will sign his contract with the Rockets on July 10, once the league’s moratorium ends. The anonymous sources will go away, the media will move on to other free agents and basketball will once again be his primary focus. He’ll be healthy and free of distractions while having a prominent role in a system that fits his game alongside one of the best scorers in the league.

Dwight Howard’s decision was not an easy one, but it’s one he had to make.


Read more at http://www.hoopsworld.com/how-dwight-ho ... VeGxEZk.99

Cavs add Jarrett Jack for 4 years


Updated: July 6, 2013, 5:27 PM ET
ESPN.com news services

The Cleveland Cavaliers have reached a four-year deal that could be worth as much as $25 million with free agent Jarrett Jack, the guard confirmed to ESPN on Saturday.

The last year of the deal is a team option, league sources told ESPN.com.

The Golden State Warriors renounced their rights to Jack on Friday as part of a deal to sign free agent Andre Iguodala. That cleared the Cavs to make a deal with the 29-year-old combo guard who is coming off a season in which he averaged 12.9 points and 5.6 assists for the Warriors.

Jack is expected to play a similar role in Cleveland as he did in Golden State, where he was part of a strong three-guard rotation with Stephen Curry and Klay Thompson. The Cavs have a young backcourt with All-Star Kyrie Irving and 2012 first-round draft pick Dion Waiters that Jack will now join.

Earlier this week, the Cavs reached an agreement with free-agent forward Earl Clark on a two-year deal with a team option for next season.

Information from ESPN The Magazine's Chris Broussard and ESPN.com's Brian Windhorst was used in this report.

Jarrett Jack agreed to a four-year, $25 million contract with the Cavs on Saturday.

The fourth year of the deal is a team option. The Warriors renounced his Bird Rights and wasn't expected to be back with the signing of Andre Iguodala. The Cavs didn't have much backcourt help with Kyrie Irving and Dion Waiters last year, so this is a great landing spot for Jack. The 29-year-old guard said that Mike Brown was a big reason for choosing Cleveland. He gets a nice bump from his $4.5 million base salary last season and his big postseason was probably a part of it, shooting 50.6 percent from the field for 17.2 points per game. Kyrie Irving is a bit injury prone and Jack will have some stand-alone fantasy value, so he'll be worth your attention in the later rounds of standard drafts.

Source: Marcus Thompson on Twitter Jul 6 - 4:57 PM

Wonderful pickup for Cavs.

Jack was so underrated for the role he played in the Warriors' run last year.

VERY veteran point guard presence, who can also play shooting guard. Expect him to back up Kyrie but also play with him at times.

TFIR wrote:
VERY veteran point guard presence, who can also play shooting guard.

Not too VERY veteran I hope.

LOL, he's not that old, but by VERY veteran I mean this guy has been through the wars. Last season, he was a big time "go to" guy for the Warriors. Love this guy. Under the radar type.